To make some sort of racist statement, and, have people agree with it.
What is even worse is that I get these dreaded e mails from my father.
The ironic part?
My parents were hippies, the kind that stood for equality, peace, love and understanding. Now if I didn't know any better, I would think they had been this way all of their lives. So distressing. So I am posting a series of e mails that has been shot back and forth between family, friends and me and my brother. I cannot believe people still think this way. It is pathetic. Be warned it is disgusting.
This Makes One THINK!!!
Someone else besides me finally said
it. how many are actually paying
attention to this?
There are African Americans, Mexican
Americans, Arab Americans, Native
Americans, etc. and then there are
You pass me on the street and sneer in
my direction. You
call me "White boy," "Cracker,"
"Caveman" and that's OK.
But when I call you, Nigger, Kike,
Towelhead, Sand-nigger, camel Jockey,
Beaner, Gook, or Chink you call me a
You say that whites commit a lot of
violence against you,
so why are the ghettos the most
dangerous places to live?
You have the United Negro College Fund.
You have Martin Luther King Day.
You have Black History Month.
You have Cesar Cha vez Day.
You have Yom Hashoah
You have Ma'uled Al-Nabi
You have the NAACP.
You have BET.
If we had WET(White Entertainment
Television) we'd be
racists. if we had a White Pride Day
you would call us racists.
If we had White History Month, we'd be
If we had any organization for only
whites to "advance"
our lives, we'd be racists.
We have a Hispanic Chamber of
Commerce, a Black Chamber of Commerce, and
then we just have the plain Chamber
of Commerce. Wonder who pays for that?
If we had a college fund that only
gave white students
scholarships, you know we'd be
racists. There are over 60 openly
proclaimed Black Colleges in the US,
yet if there were "White colleges" that
would be a racist college.
In the Million Man March, you believed
that you were
marching for your race and rights. If
we marched for our race and
rights, you would call us racists.
You are proud to be black, brown,
yellow and orange, and
you're not afraid to announce it. But
when we announce our white pride,
you call us racists.
You rob us, car jack us, and shoot at
us. But, when a white
police officer shoots a black gang
member or beats up a black drug
dealer running from the law and posing
a threat to society, you call him a
I am proud. But, you call me a racist.
Why is it that only whites can be
There is nothing improper about this
Let's see which of you are proud
enough to forward it.
Here is my brother's response:
Wow, let's all don klan hats.
This is a very offensive concept, because your argument comes
from a perspective of superiority and assumes that
only whites can be civilized.
Need I remind you that Timothy McVeigh, The Una-Bomber, Ted Bundy, Ken Lay, and most serial killers are white males?
Perhaps those are just inconvenient facts.
Or maybe you forgot about the numerous Euro-centric
festivals held every year?
If I'm not mistaken, Oktoberfest is a German holiday, St. Patrick's Day is an Irish holiday, and these are just the most visible examples. I think instead of this bullshit, 'Woe is me, the world hates me' attitude, we should see things as they really
You, I and most white folk have it pretty well. I'm really sorry that you believe there is some kind of conspiracy against white folks, maybe it's because they just got rid of slavery and you're afraid of what they might take next. As for me, I'll continue to deal in reality.
Here is the response to his response:
Racism is racism, no matter one's culture, rationale,
or skin color. Being a young sprat, you may not
recall Hubert Humphrey promising, when he lobbied for
the 1964 Civil Rights Act, that he'd " eat his hat
if it resulted in quotas or any such things. Good
thing he's dead or the price of fedoras would be
awry... along with his naïveté. And his digestive system.
The argument presented has nothing to do with
nationalities, nor with self-pity, nor with one's
relative status (though your grandmother's childhood,
and my mother's, might belie that "white folks have it
pretty well," a rather sweeping claim in itself ; but
that's another debate.) It has to do with hypocrisy.
We all indulge in it somehow : it's not "reality" to
pretend it doesn't exist. Rather we should make an
effort to eliminate it, or reconcile our beliefs to
Glad to see you have your Dad's spunk. He too was once
So here is my bro's response to that:
You are absolutely correct, racism is racism.
You make a very valid point.
If you extrapolate the implications of this concept, verily you will come to the conclusion that the concept of this chain e-mail is racist. I assume that you are referring Affirmative Action. I can, and do see why someone who is white would be upset by this law.
After all, aren't there laws that protect everyones rights, regardless of color and creed?
Why should a minority get special treatment?
If these laws are enforced universally, there should be no need for Affirmative Action.
This, sadly, is not the case. The fact of the matter is that we do not, despite what this chain e-mail assumes, live in an ideal world.
Racism cannot be turned off like a faucet. The reason programs like Affirmative Action exist is to counter balance modern racism. I would go on to comment on the state of predominately black
inner-city schools, and the disadvantages that afforded by
them, but I'm quite sure that already know that's why
minorities get scholarships that white kids can't.
So rather than reconcile my beliefs to accommodate racism,
I take full responsibility for changing attitudes like
If your life experience has been soured by unfortunate run-ins with minorities, I'll understand your point of view.
If you've seen the Black Panthers put up a cross on Fountain Square for black superiority, I'll understand.
If you've been detained by the U.S. government for four years without being charged with a crime, I'll understand.
If you've been pulled over because you were in the wrong neighborhood, I'll understand.
If you've been lynched, beaten, or verbally accosted because of the color of your skin, I'll understand.
If you get cross looks because of your religious garments, I'll understand; but if none of these things have happened to you, your just being racist.
And yet another response to what my brother says, and btw, I agree with my brother:
I believe most minorities are more racist than I am. Always
looking to play the race card anytime it suits them. Sort of
like a dog barking because he knows he is going to get a
bone. The ironic thing is we have anti-racists always backing
them up and supporting their racist attitudes. The thing is
they think they are doing good.
Affirmative action is like making a person eat peas who doesnt
like peas. They don't like peas. and never will.
Note: I wouldn't hire a person of color when I was hiring
because I was concerned about what would happen if I fired
them. Does that make me a racist, if so, its the system that
fuels it. I was just smart business..
So a vicious circle. What a mixed up world. It will never be
So my brother responds to that with:
It does make you a racist. If you are ethical, and you fire
someone, you will be backed up by the system. Ohio is an at-will
state. You can hire and fire anyone for any reason. It's only a
vicious circle if you complete the loop. Do you think that the
few minorities who play the race card would do so if they could
depend on people like you hiring them when they are unemployed?
What if that minority is more qualified than a white person?
What does "I was just smart business" mean?
To which Rusty responds:
Then so be it I am a racist just like everyone else, and anyone who
says they don't have a bit of racism in them is lying. It was smart
business not to hire them. At all costs to avoid having to deal with
the system in reagrds to firing a minority. More qualified with lots
of potential baggage, I don't need. I ask for more resumes until I
get what I want.
This is a useless discussion.
This is where I jumped in, following is what I wrote:
Maybe I am naive.
Maybe I have rose colored glasses.
But I like to think that I am not racist.
Prejudiced? Certainly, more so then I like.
Racist? I beg to differ.
What bothers me is when people _*ASSume*_, that others are racist simply because they themselves are, and it makes one feel less guilty when there is a crowd you belong to.
What bothers me is small minded individuals who cannot get past the color of another persons skin.
What bothers me is some one who would willingly pass over a qualified person, simply because they may have a different color skin, a different set of beliefs, a different or in fact no religion.
What bothers me is that someone would consider all of those things to be baggage.
What bothers me is a person that would do all of that, yet still have the nerve to cry "poor me".
*_It is not_ *poor me if you can actively discriminate against a group of people, simply because they happen to be different from you.
*_It is absolutely disgusting_* that someone would rather hire a person who may have less skill, qualifications, and or experience, simply because they are white.
Furthermore, the rationalization that hiring someone who is not like you, will cause you to become ensnared in some sort of messy legal action, if they happen to get fired, is a moot point.
As Mike has pointed out, Ohio is an at will state, I am not sure
if Kentucky is however. I will look tomorrow and see what i come up with.
You can be damn sure, that my son, will not ever, be told that that is acceptable behaviour.
_*It is not, sir*_.
It is the behaviour of a person who is too narrow minded, and afraid to do the right thing. I am ashamed of my own race, when I see and hear about people who are like this.
I am sure that _you_ will view this as some sort of idealistic, liberal, hippie propaganda.
That is _your choice._
Just as it is _my choice _to view your opinion as racist, conservative, old fogie bullshit.
A useless discussion is one that has no merit what so ever, a discussion that you learn nothing from.
I however think this discussion has merit. But then again, I think
"this is a useless discussion", is a cop out.
Viva la resistance! (Mike that is for you!)
That was last night at about 11 that I responded. This morning I get this, well everyone on the list gets this:
It appears to me that most of us, in general, agree what racism is, and are
opposed to it when practiced individually. The salient point is that some of
us applaud overt racism, as long as it's practiced by the government. For a
Noble, Higher Purpose, of course.
As long as we know what we actually believe. Arbeit macht frei.
I looked up the last little bit, because it sounded hauntingly familiar. Here is my response:
It would appear that some of us, do not in fact agree as to what constitutes racism. This has been a very eye opening set of emails bandied back and forth.
I am sure someone will, at some point simplify everything by saying it is a generational thing. As in the younger generation (me, my brother) is idealistic, and have not had the experiences that the older generation (you, Rusty, my parents, etc.) has had.
And up to a certain point that is true.
We have not had the various experiences that you, the general you, have had.
We, for the most part, were not around when the civil rights movement started.
We are one of the first generations to have been brought up in a society that has touted the need for equality.
So for us, it is only natural that we want equality for everyone, regardless of color, creed, sexuality, etc.
We (again the general we, there are always exceptions to the rule) do not want special rights for various different groups, but rather, we want the same rights for every group.
We want to be able to believe, and forgive me if this is offensive, that old white men, will not discriminate against women, blacks, Hispanics, Muslims, Jews, homosexuals, Asians, Native Americans, etc., and so on.
Because typically, that is who the normal discriminator has been, male Caucasians.
I do not like Affirmative Action, but I understand why it is needed. It is needed because people still to this day, discriminate against groups of people, solely based on the skin color, the gender, the life style preference, and the religion. So until the day when people are hired based on their qualifications and only their qualifications, a program to ensure that everyone gets a fair shake at things, will be needed. I call it a necessary evil. And no it is in no way perfect, but it is better then nothing.
I want to know that the little girls that live next door to me, will be able to get a job one day, and not have to worry that they will be passed over because they have a darker skin color, and are female. I want to know that the person most qualified for the job gets the job, not the whitest person gets the job.
I have to say I am very distressed that someone would pass over qualified candidates, because they are a different skin tone, religion , or gender. I am even more distressed that others would pat this person on the back for doing it, and somehow find a reason to think this type of behaviour is acceptable. Or look the other way, and not confront the person on the said bad behviour and judgment. It makes those in the know culpable. It makes those who stand back and do nothing as guilty as the person who refuses to hire the qualified candidate on the basis of race, gender, etc.
As a personal aside to this, I do not like the N word, ever. I don't like it when it is in rap songs, and I didn't like it when my grandma used it to describe a group of people. I don't like the words spic, kike, camel jockey, feminazi, fag, towel head, jungle bunny, and any other number of offensive and frankly ridiculous terms used to describe a group of people.
I find those words to be offensive, and those who use them, to be sad, little people who have a chip on their shoulders the size of Australia. I find those that use these terms, as if they were some how normal everyday words, to be ignorant, dumb, and stupid.
I also find anything having to do with Hitler and the Nazi's to be disgusting, so your particular phrase, Arbeit macht frei, which as you must know was used at many of the Nazi concentration camps, most notably, Auschwitz, is to me a vulgar and disgusting thing.
It marks anything you write, as invalid, at least in my eyes.
I then received this little ditty:
wow. robyn. calm down. we have all had experiences
that cause us to believe and act the way we do. that's
just the way it is.... we would all like an equal
world, i'm sure. doesn't alway's work that way.
Now for the record, this is from a person who should have a real interest in equality, as they are one of the minorities I have mentioned several time, not by skin color, but by gender and lifestyle. Heh. Not only that, but this is someone who is a close family friend.
Here is the response I gave:
I didn't think my response was all that, well, rabid.
I was simply replying to a few things that I think needed to be addressed. I can understand that someone might think I was attacking Greg, when I referenced his use of Nazi propaganda. I however feel I was attacking the use of something that doesn't have a place in this discussion, and was certainly to my mind and eyes, completely out of context within this discussion.
You are correct, everyone has different experiences, but having experiences, does not negate the fact that things still need to change. It is a simple fact. The world we live in today, should be based on things other then race, creed, etc., and so on.
Sadly, the world we live in, is not this way. We still judge the book by the cover. And we still have people who perpetuate discrimination on a daily basis, because in their reasoning, it is just too complicated, to not discriminate, when the truth of the matter is that they just do not want to hire someone who is different. Which is sad.
I am not angry, or riled up by this discussion.
In fact this is something that at first I was not going to respond to. I normally just delete any mass mailings that come my way, that have a certain tone to them. And I did delete it as soon as I received it.
Then, I got the response that Michael sent out, and I thought to myself, that he had a great point. I was proud to see him stand up against something that was absolutely in my opinion, and obviously in his, a disgusting notion. And then I saw the responses to his response, and I could not sit still.
Again, I am not upset, or foaming and frothing at the mouth, chomping at the bit, or even beating a dead horse here, I am simply expressing my feelings on this matter.
What can I say, I like a good argument. Just like Dad. Heh.
So this is what I have been doing in my spare time. I am not angry, just saddened that people are still this way. Yes, I made the views I do not agree with, pink on purpose. Hehe.
So what do you think?